Post #705868 by TikiTacky on Mon, Jan 27, 2014 11:38 AM

On 2014-01-27 11:09, bigbrotiki wrote:

On 2014-01-27 10:53, TikiTacky wrote:
Serious question: There seems to be a lot of debate as to whether something is "tiki" or not, yet tiki seems to be a generic term at this point for anything Polynesian themed. What is the distinction between saying something is tiki and saying it's Poly-Pop, aside from the fact that they may have used tiki imagery? It seems like splitting hairs, but maybe I'm missing something.

You are aiming to write the TIKIPEDIA, and you think it's splitting hairs to differentiate between Polynesian Pop and Pre-Tiki, and the Tiki period !? I thought the aim was to DEFINE Tiki style.

Well, you might as well ride the wave, make the site a party and cocktail site along with many of those documentaries. Fact is before the Book of Tiki came out, many of these places and things were called "Hawaiian" and "Polynesian" and "Tropical". And you know what? They still are - UNLESS they employed the Tiki image in their architecture, design and graphics.

I know people don't like to think, differentiate, or get their bubbles burst. So just continue along the happy path of throwing it all together - it's just supposed to be fun, after all, right ?

Sorry, but I am really tired to explain it, can't somebody else do it, PLEASE !? I have done it way too many times, in fact I just did it in my two lasts posts above, if that does not do it, together with my chart, I dunno...

First of all, I never claimed to be an authority on this. I'm not "writing" the Tikipedia—I set it up and am running it along with Nomeus. We're encouraging people who are knowledgeable about various subjects to contribute. A wiki is by its very nature collaborative, and no single person is in charge (well, I suppose I could delete everyone's posts, but that's counterproductive).

The aim is to be a source for knowledge about everything that makes up what we call "tiki." That includes people, places, things, and concepts. And yes, there will be disagreement about some of the concepts. For an academic, you should know as well as anyone that disagreement is a core part of any academic field. Some things are clearly defined, some are still in discussion.

You complain that no one seems to "get" what tiki is. That is either because it isn't as easily defined as you claim, or you haven't been able to explain it well. I asked whether the only thing that defines tiki is the actual use of a tiki, and the answer seems to be yes ("UNLESS they employed the Tiki image in their architecture, design and graphics.") But what I'm not understanding is why that matters. If people had called it a coconut movement, would we be arguing about who first used coconuts? What about tapa cloth? Should they be called tapa bars? And you say the use of a tiki image defines what is tiki, but then note places that used the image that aren't tiki. Clearly you see a distinction that we don't, and obviously I'm struggling to understand what that is.

It seems to me you have defined very well when tikis started to be used as a visual element, but not why they were so important to the concept, other than being an easily identifiable Polynesian element? There are plenty of elements that make up a tiki bar. What if the bar was decked out in 50s diner theme with vinyl booths, checkered tiled floors, a jukebox, and a tiki. Is it a tiki bar? If a restaurant has palm trees, waterfalls, paintings of hula dancers, waitresses in grass skirts, but no tikis on display is it not a tiki bar?

I'm not trying to be difficult, Sven, but I'm trying to figure out what it is that makes the tiki so centrally important to the tiki concept that we can say Don the Beachcomber had every single element of "tiki style," including a tiki on display, but for some reason it's not tiki. Are you saying that we simply don't call it tiki because tikis weren't popular yet? It seems somewhat arbitrary.

Help me, and everyone else, understand. Clarity is needed, exasperation isn't. If I can get a clear understanding of this I'll be happy to put it on Tikipedia and let other people add to it, disagree with it, or whatever.

EDIT: Added emphasis so people understand how a wiki is supposed to work.

T-shirts based on vintage tiki matchbooks: TikiTees

[ Edited by: TikiTacky 2014-01-27 11:50 ]